Defend the Block 390 - CJ Moore Transcript
6/30/2026 9:31:00 AM | MGoBlue Podcasts
Brian Boesch • 00:00
Few have been as locked in on the pulse of Dusty May's ascension from Florida Atlantic to Michigan, and now the NBA's Dallas Mavericks is the outstanding CJ Moore, writer for the Athletic. Over the last week, Moore has written two great pieces about the crazy week for Michigan men's basketball. One about May's decision to head to the league. And what about Mike Boynton Jr.'s work as the interim head coach? CJ was nice enough to spend 20 minutes with me on Monday afternoon to reflect on those two articles and his interactions with both May and Boynton, along with where Michigan goes from here. Now, CJ spent entire week at the Players Era in Las Vegas, immersed in Michigan's program at games, around meeting rooms, as Michigan foreshadowed what was to come with the run to the national championship over the following months. So, as we watch and wait for more information within the program, let's get some perspective from one of the most informed people about Michigan basketball and outside the program.
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Brian Boesch • 01:01
CJ Moore writes for the Athletic. Two great articles you've got to check out. He joins us next on Defend the Block.
Jeff Laurence • 01:09
We're talking Michigan basketball. Welcome to Defend the Block, where we'll take you inside the basketball programs with interviews, analysis and so much more. Now here's your host, Brian Boesch.
Brian Boesch • 01:23
Always fantastic to catch up with The Athletic's CJ Moore; you've been immersed with Dusty a lot in the week that has elapsed since. Have you thought back to any conversations, interactions with Dusty that may have foreshadowed this or given you a clue that this was possible this quickly?
CJ Moore • 01:40
Yeah, I have. I think that, you know, the first thing that struck me about Dusty May back when I started getting to know him years ago, was that he kind of knows everybody in the basketball world and particularly, you know, particularly in the NBA. Like, you know, he was really close. He's really close with Woj. He's close with some other NBA coaches. I think that that game has always obviously interested in him. And, and he's had a curiosity of how he could do at that level. And, you know, after the championship game and then the weeks that followed, in the months that followed, like, when I would talk to him, like, he's like, have you been able to enjoy this? Not, not really. You know, it's just been a whirlwind. And so I, like, I had a friend that covers the NBA asked me maybe a month before he took the job, like, do you think there's any chance, Dusty?
CJ Moore • 02:45
Because I was like, yeah, probably not. Like, not like, maybe like someday, but not, not right after this championship. But, you know, I was kind of kicking myself up probably. I was obviously wrong on that. And as you, as you pull back and you think about it and you think about conversations you've had, like, yeah, I get it and I understand it. And you know, the fact that what he really enjoys and I wrote about this last week, is just the nerdy basketball stuff. And I think that college basketball has become so much more of managing all the other things. And, you know, I go back to a conversation I had about Modi with him, the assistant coach he hired from Japan, you know, who's coaching Japan, and that he was kind of jealous that like, Modi was looking forward to doing more player development stuff and working with the guys and Dusty, like, yeah, I don't get to do as much as that as I want to, you know, used to be able to.
CJ Moore • 03:44
I think that when you look at what an NBA job is and when you look at what a college basketball job is for what he enjoys is probably more in line with what the NBA job is right now than, than what it is to be a college basketball coach.
Brian Boesch • 03:59
Trying to read the tea leaves in the last week, I never still to this point, I don't perceive it as it was a, an NBA-or-bust type of an offseason for Dusty. Was the Dallas job just that good? Is it fair to say that realistically this might be the best job that comes on the market not just in this cycle, but in the next couple?
CJ Moore • 04:20
Yeah, possibly. I mean, Cooper Flagg is a big part of that. Masai, you know, is a very respected person in the NBA and has built a championship team before in Toronto. I think that of all the college coaches who have left and taken a NBA job and through all the years, this one's probably set up about as well as maybe since Larry Brown took like the Spurs back in the day when they were, you know, they were going to have. They didn't even have David Robinson, I guess he was the next year. So, really? Yeah, this is probably the one. And see, I, I think that if I'm sure, like, he was operating this offseason this summer, like he was going to be the Michigan coach last, this, next year. Like, I don't think there's. I don't think he had his eyes like dead set on the NBA, like, I gotta get an NBA job. I think when this opportunity came up and you start to pull back and you think about like, OK, they got Cooper Flagg, the management's right, yada yada yada.
CJ Moore • 05:26
I think he probably decided like, if I'm going to do this and I haven't had a chance to talk, you know, I've text with them since, but I haven't had a chance to sit down with them and hopefully will soon at some point. But I'm sure he thought, if I'm gonna do this in the next several years, will I ever get an opportunity as good as this one? And I bet you that's was a big part of him being like, I gotta take it, like, if, if I really want to do this someday, why not now?
Brian Boesch • 05:55
So, you mentioned the article you wrote about Dusty from earlier, about a day or two after Dusty left for Dallas, check it out on The Athletic. You also wrote one over the weekend on a conversation you had with Mike Boynton Jr. as we talk here on Monday afternoon, the interim coach for Michigan men's basketball. Just your biggest takeaways from an article that is a must-read for Michigan fans.
CJ Moore • 06:16
Yeah, I think the biggest thing, the biggest news pegged to me was that Mike is very much this week and this past, you know, last week and this week trying to get that interim tag removed and be, to be the permanent head coach at Michigan. And how he's, you know, how they are considering that he's really pushed that and you know, he believes he's the best man for the job going forward. And I guess, you know, I, I went into that conversation, you know, obviously he wants that, he hopes that. But I came out of it thinking, OK, it's probably more realistic than maybe I thought going in. Like, you don't really know. Like when, when they say 'interim,' that could be an interim for a week, could be interim for two weeks, three weeks, the whole season. That's a very vague title, right? Like it's, it's always some kind. Somebody on the staff usually takes over that job in the transition period.
CJ Moore • 07:21
And sometimes there's a national search, sometimes there's not. This one is. There's no, I don't. I get the idea. There's impression there's no national shirts right now. It's a very weird time to have one if, if you were going to. Because it is. We're on, you know, late June, the coaching carousel is done. I. There are probably some coaches that might take it. You know, Billy Donovan's out there, which is the, you know, is. Will he ever return back to college basketball? We don't know. He seems to have expressed some interest in doing that maybe, but, you know, you don't know for certain. So, I think Michigan has a decision to make on, on whether, you know, because recruiting's going on right now, you know, you're starting to recruit these next few classes. When you are trying to get commitments from the guys that have multiple years left, it's a lot easier to commit, get commitments from those guys if you know that, you know, they know who the coach is going to be, not just next season, but the season after and the season after that.
CJ Moore • 08:20
So, I understand Mike's perspective and I understand the spot Michigan's in if, if they want to decide to keep him as the, as the head coach or, you know, continue with this, this interim tag. But I, I would be very surprised if Mike Boynton in some capacity is not the coach this upcoming season.
Brian Boesch • 08:40
The quote that I took the most from this thinking of, hey, it does feel likely that, that Boynton at the very least will get this upcoming season, but we'll see. Boynton told you, quote, he being Dusty, he's elite at delegating and managing people, surrounding himself with people he could trust to do jobs well, allowing them to do it well. I think in two years Dusty may, maybe he was on the defensive side of the court in a practice maybe one time, maybe. Dusty talks a lot about superpowers. I always thought, in being around him, that his ability to delegate was maybe his most important superpower in college. To the point you talked about, you don't get a lot of one-on-one. He's not coaching directly as much. How do you think Mike Boynton, a relationships guy, obviously an elite defensive coach, can level up to what will be required of him beyond the coaching responsibilities in this type of a role?
CJ Moore • 09:32
Yeah, I think being around those guys, I think the one thing that Mike really did well for Dusty is he covered some of his blind spots and he made sure to kind of help keep it organized, keep everything organized. And that was a role for him in, in addition to the defense side of the ball. And I, I think that from just a CEO standpoint, like Mike was CEO junior for that team. And so I think in that realm he has probably grown and in a really good spot defensively. Obviously, he's proven himself not just at Michigan, but at Oklahoma State too, to be a very good defensive coach. I think what will be important for him and what he said in the story is who can he find to help run the offense? And you know, that quote to me was like, I'm going to be on the defensive side of the ball and I'm not going to be over on the offensive side. I'm going to be just like Dusty. I'm going to find somebody and trust them and put my faith in them that they can handle that side.
CJ Moore • 10:38
And I want to continue to play very similarly to how Dusty played because obviously that did very well, right? And also be able and willing to, you know, he brought up, I didn't put in the story, but he brought up the, the Vlad Goldin, Danny Wolf pick-and-roll and how they discovered that in practice by accident, you know, that first season. And that really became a huge part of what they were. So being willing to change and adapt to what your roster is, I think that's something he also, you know, really took from Dusty and, and plans to, to operate that way moving forward. So um, I do think that, you know, sometimes the best thing that can happen to you is failure in life and learning from. Not to say that Mike was a failure at Oklahoma State, but he did get fired. Like he, he wasn't able to continue the job. And sometimes I think that that can be really beneficial to you in life when you learn from your mistakes or learn from, from you know, things you don't think you did necessarily as well.
CJ Moore • 11:44
And when you get your next shot, you're able to do those things better. Look at Mike Brown who just won an NBA championship, like he was a fired head coach. So, I don't think you necessarily rule out a guy who has been fired at that level. And I think Mike has grown a lot and you know, will be better at the job than he was the previous time and obviously didn't have the resources he had at it will have at a Michigan, at Oklahoma State.
Brian Boesch • 12:15
Speaking of Mike Brown, he might still be asking who let the dogs out in New York, whereas Dusty got an hour of sleep and was on Good Morning America after winning a national championship. So, that's another unique dynamic. We're with CJ Moore here on from The Athletic on Defend the Block. You mentioned trying to find an offensive mind. How much more difficult, if at all, is it for a defensive-minded head coach to, in a long-term setting here find offensive minds versus what Dusty did of focusing offensively and finding a defensive mind? Is there a big gap there if we're looking at what a Mike Boynton Jr.-led program could be two, three years down the road?
CJ Moore • 12:53
I don't think it's any necessarily any more difficult than going and finding a defensive guy. I think there are a lot of good coaches out there. You know, Modi, who was going to come with Dusty, I know it seems like from I got the impression he was going to be more defense-oriented. But I also think he could probably be an offensive guy. And I've talked to people that think he's really, really, really, really smart. Even had a former player after that story came out, text me and be like, this guy's going to be a great head coach someday. So, you know, he might end up following Dusty to Dallas, but maybe that's the guy. So, it is a weird spot trying to go find that guy right now when everybody's kind of, you know, not anticipating moving, but you are at Michigan. I think it's a lot easier for him to find that guy if he is the head coach and not the interim because it's going to be difficult to get somebody really, really good to come and, you know, be on your staff when it might just be a year and there might be somebody that's currently on the staff that has helped on that side of the ball that could step over and do the job right away.
CJ Moore • 14:07
So, I do know, you know, from talking to him, his focus is on getting the roster set, making sure he gets, you know, as many of those guys back as he can. And then he's going to turn to his staff and figure that piece out. And by the time he turns to his staff and figures that piece out, he should know whether he has an arm tag or not.
Brian Boesch • 14:27
A lot of people, myself included, believe that the acclimation for Dusty, college to the NBA, will go pretty smoothly. Is there an element that you're most curious about of Dusty May as an NBA coach?
CJ Moore • 14:40
Not necessarily. I think he'll be really good at it. I think that the challenge with the NBA is in college, like, as a college basketball coach, you are the GM as well, and you get to build the roster and you get to decide who's on your team and who's not. You don't necessarily get that ability in the NBA and often the coach is as good as their roster is. So, that's something where you look long-term and look at the, like, longevity of the job, how long you can stay in that job? Like, it is easier to retain your job in colleges because you're more in control. But like we talked about earlier, you know, it really, really helps to have a Cooper Flagg. And I think that'll give you some stability the next few years. So, I think from the offensive side, from the comm, like the biggest thing with Dusty and I talked about this in a story I wrote last week, like, he came away thinking he could do the job when he went to visit the Atlanta Hawks a few years ago when he was still at FAU and he said a big part of what he came away with there was like how much Quin Snyder taught thought about what his message delivery was going to be to his team and how he was going to talk to his team.
CJ Moore • 15:57
And I think Dusty is about as good as communicator as a head coach and, and very intentional in what he says to his team and how he delivers a message. I think he's a, one of the best I've been around in that regard. And I think that's something that he'll, he'll be able to connect with those guys just because he's the type of person that, like, he just kind of a regular dude, right? Like, you know, it, he connects with people. He doesn't feel. He feels very approachable. I think from a relationship side, he'll be really, really good in the NBA. And I think that's important in all coaching levels, but especially that that level it will be.
Brian Boesch • 16:35
Your story from Vegas, quoting the couple of beers Shane Gillis SNL skit is I think the perfect embodiment of Dusty just hey, he could branch off. Of the three Michigan NBA draft lottery picks, which fit intrigues you most?
CJ Moore • 16:52
They're all pretty interesting. I love Aday and I'm a big believer in him, and I'm very intrigued to see how he translates to the NBA level and that Oklahoma City team. Like, to me, that pick was in part made because, OK, their goal right now is to figure out the Spurs and how to beat the Spurs. Like, it's them and the Spurs at the time. Like, you know, somebody else could enter that. That tier. But right now, they're on a tier by themselves in that Western Conference. And so, they've got to figure out a way to get back and beat those guys. And to me, like, you know, Aday can't necessarily be your only Victor stopper, but he is giant in a way that Victor is. And he can do some things around the basket that Victor can do. And you know, his passing, how that will translate, how they'll play him, how much they'll play him. I think that Yaxel and Morez probably have an easier path to playing time and roles early on.
CJ Moore • 17:57
But you know, when I look at those three guys, Aday might have the biggest, the highest ceiling. And I'm very intrigued to see what he does. And I mean, you've been around him. He's just such a, like, awesome young man that you're just like, you want it to work out for him, especially what he went through at UCLA. And so, I think that one is the one I'm most intrigued by. And I'll be trying, I'll try as best I can, to watch a lot of OKC basketball next year. Probably because not only I have him, but they have Bennett Stirtz, who was one of my favorite college guys to cover the last few years and his story is just unbelievable. And Michigan fans are obviously familiar with that, having played him and you know, he's a KC-area guy and I live in Kansas City, so got a little extra incentive to watch that one.
Brian Boesch • 18:43
Hey, I, I mean I love all three of those guys, Rez, Yax and Aday, but I always appreciated that Aday never bad-mouthed Mick Cronin. I think we can all guess he probably wanted to if he could have gotten some truth serum, but he did not. He was always very respectful. Yeah, rooting for him. Last one. Ten years from now when we talk about the 2025-26 Michigan Wolverines, what do you think will be the, at the top of your memories from what was a 37-3 Big Ten champion by four games, national champion group?
CJ Moore • 19:14
I think, you know, obviously having the chance to be around those guys will, will be the first thing that, that comes to mind. And just like how much they enjoyed each other's company. I think the, the storyline of that they're just mercenaries and stuff. Like, if you spend any time around them, you know, that was not like that was a team that was. They really enjoyed being together. So, special group. And then I think the other thing that will come to mind is how dominant they were when they played their A game. And I mean that the Players Era festival was the introduction for the college basketball universe to what they could be and what they were. And they were able to, you know, not necessarily carry that from then on to the end. You know, they kind of had some, a few little bumps in the road, but they were pretty darn dominant from there going forward.
CJ Moore • 20:10
And you know, I thought they had a pretty, pretty convincing run in the NCAA Tournament. So, you know, one of the better teams we've seen probably in the last decade in college basketball. And then the other big thing is like, you know, going into the year, everybody, can they play big? Can they play big? You know, how are they going to play these three guys together? And the fact that they were able to pull that off and do so so smoothly is probably something I'll remember, and it'll be something to watch going forward here these next couple years. Like when a team has that much success, others are going to try to lean into that strategy and we'll see what, you know, these next few years look like. In college basketball, everything kind of goes in cycles and changes and, you know, that could be out really, really quickly. You know, you look at the NBA game and there's a lot more perimeter guys on the floor than, than big guys, but they're.
CJ Moore • 21:00
Perimeter guys are pretty good size. But yeah. So, those are kind of the things I think will come to mind.
Brian Boesch • 21:06
Yeah, that from the Dusty side is why I'm probably most bummed out basketball-wise that he's not going to be in Michigan next year. He had a chance to go from having the best frontcourt in the country to having the best backcourt in the country. Like, how does he move the chess pieces differently?
CJ Moore • 21:18
Yeah.
Brian Boesch • 21:18
Would have been really fun to watch.
CJ Moore • 21:20
And he did that pretty well at FAU. Like, he played with very small teams and, and one, they were, they were still going to be, they're still going to be pretty big. They're going to be a small group.
Brian Boesch • 21:31
Well, I'm glad the Players Era introduced us as well. CJ, appreciate you making some time for us on Defend the Block. And again, if you haven't checked out the articles on The Athletic, definitely do. So I appreciate the time, my friend.
CJ Moore • 21:41
Thank you. Thanks for having me.
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Brian Boesch • 21:51
A few programming notes before we get out of here on Defend the Block. Coming up tomorrow, Wednesday, on In the Trenches, presented by Meijer. Linebackers coach Alex Whittingham is our guest. Then we will take a little bit of a break leading up to fall camp on In the Trenches. So, no episodes for at least a few weeks there, but we will be back ready to roll for the 2026 season on In the Trenches. Of course, Conquering Heroes will return as we get closer to fall semester and Defend the Block. We will keep weeks leading up to the season, get some women's basketball guests on the horizon, and obviously react to what has been a pretty crazy last little bit for the Michigan men's basketball program. So again, it was great to have CJ Moore stop by, somebody who's done great reporting on the departure of Dusty May and on the interim appointment of Mike Boynton Jr. We'll see if there is more beyond just that interim role for Mike.
Brian Boesch • 22:47
All right, thanks to CJ, thanks to all of you. Again, Alex Whittingham on In the Trenches on Wednesday. Then we'll take a little bit of a break there. We should be able to keep things rolling on Defend the Block. Expect to catch up with Dusty May in the coming weeks as well. Excited to hear from him after a two-season run in Ann Arbor that got to the very highest high you can in college basketball and also, of course, ended a little bit quicker than we all anticipated. So, thanks to CJ, thanks to all of you, and happy Independence Weekend coming up. Hope you're able to celebrate with friends and family and stay cool during this very warm stretch in Michigan and beyond. Thanks for listening to Defend the Block and Go Blue.
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Jeff Laurence • 23:27
Thanks for listening to today's edition of Defend the Block, part of our Michigan Athletics Podcast Network, MGoBlue Podcasts. The preceding has been a Learfield presentation of the Michigan Sports Network.
